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From: Claire Forbes
Date: Tue, Feb 27 2024 4:30AM
Subject: Document headings
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Good morning,
I have a question regarding Heading Levels, please see the below for context and I'll ask my question at the end.

I created a one-page document that flowed with the following document styles:

* The document title as a Heading Level 1 <H1>
* Then a Paragraph of content <P>
* Then goes into a Heading Level 2 + the next section of content <H2> <P>
* The rest of the document goes from various <H2> to <P> until the end
The document title is also in the header and the company logo is in the footer.

Our QA office reviewed the document and removed the document title as Heading Level 1, started the document with a paragraph of instruction, then made all my original Heading Level 2s into Heading Level 1s.
So here's the QA's document structure: <P>, <H1>, <P>, <P>,<P>,<H1>, <P>, <P>, <H1>, <P>, etc....

Can someone please confirm this is non-complaint? A document should always start with an <H1> and not a <P>, correct?
Just because the document title is in the header of the document that's not a case for compliance because screen readers don't read headers and footers, correct?

Thank you!
Claire

From: L Snider
Date: Tue, Feb 27 2024 4:57AM
Subject: Re: Document headings
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I personally don't agree with their approach. For me, there is one H1 and
then H2’s, etc. like you described below.

I dont follow wcag for headings, I go way further. In my view, wcag is
flawed in its approach to heading order and numbers. In my view, numbers
are there for a reason. Everyone I ever met who relies on a screen reader
every day told me this, so that is what I do.

Sometimes the document does start with a paragraph. I’ve had that happen a
few times, that’s not a major issue in my view. Screen, reader users, who
rely on the technology every day, usually list the headings first (not
every single one, of course because everybody’s different, but almost
everybody, I’ve ever met has told me this-There is no ‘here’s how to use
the screen reader’ school, most people I know, learned the technology on
the fly, and not through an organization).

I always recommend not to put important things in a header or footer,
because they can often be invisible.

I would personally agree with your approach.

Cheers

Lisa


On Tue, Feb 27, 2024 at 7:30 AM Claire Forbes < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:

> Good morning,
> I have a question regarding Heading Levels, please see the below for
> context and I'll ask my question at the end.
>
> I created a one-page document that flowed with the following document
> styles:
>
> * The document title as a Heading Level 1 <H1>
> * Then a Paragraph of content <P>
> * Then goes into a Heading Level 2 + the next section of content <H2>
> <P>
> * The rest of the document goes from various <H2> to <P> until the end
> The document title is also in the header and the company logo is in the
> footer.
>
> Our QA office reviewed the document and removed the document title as
> Heading Level 1, started the document with a paragraph of instruction, then
> made all my original Heading Level 2s into Heading Level 1s.
> So here's the QA's document structure: <P>, <H1>, <P>, <P>,<P>,<H1>, <P>,
> <P>, <H1>, <P>, etc....
>
> Can someone please confirm this is non-complaint? A document should always
> start with an <H1> and not a <P>, correct?
> Just because the document title is in the header of the document that's
> not a case for compliance because screen readers don't read headers and
> footers, correct?
>
> Thank you!
> Claire
> > > > >

From: Dean.Vasile@outlook.com
Date: Tue, Feb 27 2024 6:11AM
Subject: Re: Document headings
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Good morning! In terms of document structure and accessibility, it's generally recommended to start with an `<h1>` heading for the main title or heading of the document. This helps in organizing content hierarchically and assists screen readers and other assistive technologies in understanding the structure of the document.

Starting with a `<p>` paragraph instead of an `<h1>` heading might not align with best practices for accessibility and document structure. While having the document title in the header is a common practice, it doesn't replace the need for an `<h1>` heading within the document itself. Screen readers typically focus on the content area and might not automatically detect the title from the header.

Therefore, your original structure with the document title as an `<h1>` seems more compliant with accessibility standards compared to the modified structure provided by QA. It's good to ensure that the document structure follows best practices to support accessibility for all users.
Dean Vasile


617-799-1162

> On Feb 27, 2024, at 6:30 AM, Claire Forbes < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> Good morning,
> I have a question regarding Heading Levels, please see the below for context and I'll ask my question at the end.
>
> I created a one-page document that flowed with the following document styles:
>
> * The document title as a Heading Level 1 <H1>
> * Then a Paragraph of content <P>
> * Then goes into a Heading Level 2 + the next section of content <H2> <P>
> * The rest of the document goes from various <H2> to <P> until the end
> The document title is also in the header and the company logo is in the footer.
>
> Our QA office reviewed the document and removed the document title as Heading Level 1, started the document with a paragraph of instruction, then made all my original Heading Level 2s into Heading Level 1s.
> So here's the QA's document structure: <P>, <H1>, <P>, <P>,<P>,<H1>, <P>, <P>, <H1>, <P>, etc....
>
> Can someone please confirm this is non-complaint? A document should always start with an <H1> and not a <P>, correct?
> Just because the document title is in the header of the document that's not a case for compliance because screen readers don't read headers and footers, correct?
>
> Thank you!

From: Duff Johnson
Date: Tue, Feb 27 2024 6:31AM
Subject: Re: Document headings
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A document is NOT obligated to start with its title. This is not a “compliance” issue but (at most) a question of best-practice for some classes of documents. Your QA office hasn’t done anything wrong.

Related observation: HTML is unfortunate in that the <title> element is abstracted from the <body>, which has resulted in the notion that titles should be marked as <h1>.

Other technologies (e.g., PDF 2.0) provide both <Title> and <H#> elements. So, in PDF, one is not compelled to “spend” H1 on the title (thus reducing the available heading-levels for the document as a whole), but can use H# for its true semantic intent - headings.

Duff Johnson
PDF Association

> On Feb 27, 2024, at 6:30 AM, Claire Forbes < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> Good morning,
> I have a question regarding Heading Levels, please see the below for context and I'll ask my question at the end.
>
> I created a one-page document that flowed with the following document styles:
>
> * The document title as a Heading Level 1 <H1>
> * Then a Paragraph of content <P>
> * Then goes into a Heading Level 2 + the next section of content <H2> <P>
> * The rest of the document goes from various <H2> to <P> until the end
> The document title is also in the header and the company logo is in the footer.
>
> Our QA office reviewed the document and removed the document title as Heading Level 1, started the document with a paragraph of instruction, then made all my original Heading Level 2s into Heading Level 1s.
> So here's the QA's document structure: <P>, <H1>, <P>, <P>,<P>,<H1>, <P>, <P>, <H1>, <P>, etc....
>
> Can someone please confirm this is non-complaint? A document should always start with an <H1> and not a <P>, correct?
> Just because the document title is in the header of the document that's not a case for compliance because screen readers don't read headers and footers, correct?
>
> Thank you!

From: Dax Castro
Date: Tue, Feb 27 2024 6:49AM
Subject: Re: Document headings
← Previous message | Next message →

100% concur with Duff on this topic.
In fact often we see the title as an H1 followed by an arbitrary H2 for a byline or subtext just because it is large and bold. Remember that heading structure is designed to organize content and is not purely based on text size.

Dax Castro, ADS

Thanks,
Dax
From: WebAIM-Forum < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > on behalf of Duff Johnson < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2024 5:31:07 AM
To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Document headings

A document is NOT obligated to start with its title. This is not a “compliance” issue but (at most) a question of best-practice for some classes of documents. Your QA office hasn’t done anything wrong.

Related observation: HTML is unfortunate in that the <title> element is abstracted from the <body>, which has resulted in the notion that titles should be marked as <h1>.

Other technologies (e.g., PDF 2.0) provide both <Title> and <H#> elements. So, in PDF, one is not compelled to “spend” H1 on the title (thus reducing the available heading-levels for the document as a whole), but can use H# for its true semantic intent - headings.

Duff Johnson
PDF Association

> On Feb 27, 2024, at 6:30 AM, Claire Forbes < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
>
> Good morning,
> I have a question regarding Heading Levels, please see the below for context and I'll ask my question at the end.
>
> I created a one-page document that flowed with the following document styles:
>
> * The document title as a Heading Level 1 <H1>
> * Then a Paragraph of content <P>
> * Then goes into a Heading Level 2 + the next section of content <H2> <P>
> * The rest of the document goes from various <H2> to <P> until the end
> The document title is also in the header and the company logo is in the footer.
>
> Our QA office reviewed the document and removed the document title as Heading Level 1, started the document with a paragraph of instruction, then made all my original Heading Level 2s into Heading Level 1s.
> So here's the QA's document structure: <P>, <H1>, <P>, <P>,<P>,<H1>, <P>, <P>, <H1>, <P>, etc....
>
> Can someone please confirm this is non-complaint? A document should always start with an <H1> and not a <P>, correct?
> Just because the document title is in the header of the document that's not a case for compliance because screen readers don't read headers and footers, correct?
>
> Thank you!

From: Jerra Strong
Date: Thu, Feb 29 2024 4:12PM
Subject: Re: Document headings
← Previous message | No next message

In my work, I would call both methods "compliant", but having a single
Heading 1 as the document's name as the first line, and then the major
sections marked with H2 is a best practice, because it mirrors what users
expect on the web. There are a few articles about this online, I found
this one particularly helpful, because the thinking is explained:

https://accessible-digital-documents.com/blog/one-or-more-h1s-in-pdf/

On Tue, Feb 27, 2024 at 5:49 AM Dax Castro < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:

> 100% concur with Duff on this topic.
> In fact often we see the title as an H1 followed by an arbitrary H2 for a
> byline or subtext just because it is large and bold. Remember that heading
> structure is designed to organize content and is not purely based on text
> size.
>
> Dax Castro, ADS
>
> Thanks,
> Dax
> > From: WebAIM-Forum < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > on behalf of
> Duff Johnson < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
> Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2024 5:31:07 AM
> To: WebAIM Discussion List < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = >
> Subject: Re: [WebAIM] Document headings
>
> A document is NOT obligated to start with its title. This is not a
> “compliance” issue but (at most) a question of best-practice for some
> classes of documents. Your QA office hasn’t done anything wrong.
>
> Related observation: HTML is unfortunate in that the <title> element is
> abstracted from the <body>, which has resulted in the notion that titles
> should be marked as <h1>.
>
> Other technologies (e.g., PDF 2.0) provide both <Title> and <H#> elements.
> So, in PDF, one is not compelled to “spend” H1 on the title (thus reducing
> the available heading-levels for the document as a whole), but can use H#
> for its true semantic intent - headings.
>
> Duff Johnson
> PDF Association
>
> > On Feb 27, 2024, at 6:30 AM, Claire Forbes < = EMAIL ADDRESS REMOVED = > wrote:
> >
> > Good morning,
> > I have a question regarding Heading Levels, please see the below for
> context and I'll ask my question at the end.
> >
> > I created a one-page document that flowed with the following document
> styles:
> >
> > * The document title as a Heading Level 1 <H1>
> > * Then a Paragraph of content <P>
> > * Then goes into a Heading Level 2 + the next section of content <H2>
> <P>
> > * The rest of the document goes from various <H2> to <P> until the end
> > The document title is also in the header and the company logo is in the
> footer.
> >
> > Our QA office reviewed the document and removed the document title as
> Heading Level 1, started the document with a paragraph of instruction, then
> made all my original Heading Level 2s into Heading Level 1s.
> > So here's the QA's document structure: <P>, <H1>, <P>, <P>,<P>,<H1>,
> <P>, <P>, <H1>, <P>, etc....
> >
> > Can someone please confirm this is non-complaint? A document should
> always start with an <H1> and not a <P>, correct?
> > Just because the document title is in the header of the document that's
> not a case for compliance because screen readers don't read headers and
> footers, correct?
> >
> > Thank you!
>
> > > > > > > > >